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Post by BarracudasGM on Mar 10, 2011 19:30:00 GMT -5
Folks, I am an avid Montreal Canadiens fan (if you didn't know already) and the latest hit on Pacioretty by Chara has been the talk of the town for the past 48 hours.. I think from the slo-motion cameras it shows that Chara guided Max's head but anycase, I think the hit was dirty.. any thoughts? Chara should be accountable for his actions and deserves a suspension. What Bettman and Murphy has done has made the league crap. The way Bettman answered when asked about Air Canada thinking of pulling away their sponsorship was ridiculous.
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Post by Vampyre on Mar 10, 2011 20:19:21 GMT -5
It was a nasty hit/result.
Regardless of the hit, I don't think Chara intended that outcome (though I'm sure Bertuzzi didn't intend to cripple Moore either).
Players have to be responsible for their actions.
There should have been a nominal suspension to at least show that the league isn't a joke.
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Post by Oil kings GM on Mar 11, 2011 4:34:29 GMT -5
I don't see it as a dirty hit, I see it as a hockey hit that had a bad outcome. Every player that throws a body check into the boards gives an extra push or shove at the end of the check. The outcome of the check was awful. I have heard many hockey experts say that every player knows where they are on the ice at all times. So yes Chara knew where he was and Pacioretty was on the ice and vice vera. Pacioretty thought to himself that he could beat Chara along the boards to the puck with speed and he knew where he was at the time and he got injured because of it. I am not saying that it was Pacioretty's fault and I am not saying that Chara was at fault either. What I am saying is that it was a hockey play gone bad. And why did Montreal fans cheer when Hal Gill hit Jon Sim into the end board www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHHMZkpvw6cIt is the same kind of hit. I believe that if Pacioretty wasn't injured, nothing would have been said except how it was a great hit by Chara.
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Post by Ice Dragons on Mar 11, 2011 9:38:04 GMT -5
The NHL definitely has its favorites and Chara seems to be one of them. As soon as the game was over every analyst was saying that it was a hockey hit and at the worst it should have been an interference call. Now I'm not going to say he intended to injure Max but Chara was definitely trying to rub him out on the boards and dump him into the bench(my opinion). I think the injury is unfortunate but Chara shouldn't be prosecuted for it.
As far as a suspension goes Chara gets nothing because he is a star while Trevor Gillies gets 10 games for hitting Clutterbuck on a hit where Cal clearly turned torwards the boards at the last second.The funny part is that Clutterbuck boarded an Islander headfirst into the dasher 2 seconds before Gillies hit him and didn't even get minor.The point I'm trying to make is that if your a star giving someone a cheap shot they call it old school hockey and when your a 4th liner doing it they call you a thug and suspend you. The league clearly has a double standard and we can all thank Campbell for that.
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Post by Vampyre on Mar 11, 2011 10:02:38 GMT -5
And I think that's a big part of the problem....the double standard.
In reality, they could have side-stepped the issue with a bit more grace by issuing a nominal suspension for maybe 3 games....at least then the optics would have been better for the league (instead of the head-in-the-sand image they have now) and it still wouldn't have affected the Bruins' playoff aspirations.
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Post by Oil kings GM on Mar 11, 2011 11:56:57 GMT -5
The NHL as a league had to sit down and actually figure all this out. It is time to fix all the head shots (intentional or not) and all the hitting from behind.
I have said it plenty of times and that is if someone injures a player from a hit from behind, a head shot or boarding and the receiving player gets injured and is lost to his team then the player that injured the said player is suspended without pay until the injured player is fully recovered and playing again (or has to retire due to injury). Then I can honestly say that all the concussions and injuries will be less.
Imagine if Derek Boogaard runs Martin St. Louis from behind and gives him a concussion and St. Louis is gone for 6 months, then Boogard will not be playing or be paid for such act. I am sure that players will get the message.
It is like stick swinging incidents occurred. Marty McSorley on Donald Brashear, the NHL set a standard with the suspension and you haven't seen anything like that again.
This still doesn't take away how I feel about the hit Chara gave Pacioretty (a clean hit gone wrong). Maybe Chris is right and he should have received a minimal suspension, but don't throw the book at him.
The question I do want to ask is this... If Pacioretty got up from the hit would there be such a debate on the hit as there is now?
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Post by Vampyre on Mar 11, 2011 12:11:28 GMT -5
I have said it plenty of times and that is if someone injures a player from a hit from behind, a head shot or boarding and the receiving player gets injured and is lost to his team then the player that injured the said player is suspended without pay until the injured player is fully recovered and playing again (or has to retire due to injury). Then I can honestly say that all the concussions and injuries will be less. Imagine if Derek Boogaard runs Martin St. Louis from behind and gives him a concussion and St. Louis is gone for 6 months, then Boogard will not be playing or be paid for such act. I am sure that players will get the message. There is a reason why this will never be implemented (and shouldn't be). If the offender is required to sit for the length of time the injured player is gone, what stops a team from keeping a 4th liner out of the lineup longer if it was a 1st liner that injured him? For example, say Ovechkin took offense to something Cooke attempts to do to him and later took a run at Cooke when the opportunity arose, resulting in an injury to Cooke. Cooke is then put on LTIR and left there for the rest of the year/playoffs. Ovechkin would then be kept out for that entire time and the league arbitrarily loses a star player for who-knows-how-long. Cooke then becomes more valuable to the Penguins as an injured player because, while he can be easily replaced, his injury effectively neutralizes a competitor's top player, who cannot be replaced.
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Post by Oil kings GM on Mar 11, 2011 12:49:13 GMT -5
That is the thing Chris, if the league makes it known that a player will be suspended as long as the injured player is then things like that won't happen.
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Post by Vampyre on Mar 11, 2011 13:00:48 GMT -5
History seems to indicate that incidents will still happen.
If the penalty is codified like that, then there is no discretion.
Players sometimes go too far, and though I doubt that any really want to hospitalize their opponent, it will still happen.
The possibility of losing a star player for any length of time due to suspension will prevent the league from implementing this type of punishment.
Just look at how they are afraid to suspend their stars now.
I think the NHLPA needs to be more involved in this though, as it's their membership that are getting hurt, and they seem to be oddly mute.
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Post by wildcatgm on Mar 11, 2011 20:01:32 GMT -5
It was not a clean hit as it was interference. How on earth can it be both a clean play and one that is not allowed ... he got pacs from behind as Pac was by him... there was no puck around it was almost in the corner of the rink just a joke when you see what other people have been suspended for .. isn't there a rule that states whether it is intentional; or not if you injure a player you are suspended ?
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Post by RavensGM on Mar 11, 2011 20:51:36 GMT -5
Habs fans are homers, and I have no clue why they are in riot mode over this; sucks that a player got hurt over a hockey play like this. But seriously, talk of boycotting/forfeiting a game, pulling sponsorships, getting police involved, having politicians using this to gain popularity... wtf?
It wasn't a hit either, to correct everyone calling it a dirty hit.
"isn't there a rule that states whether it is intentional; or not if you injure a player you are suspended ? " -wildcatgm
lol wut? There is an intent to injure penalty, if that is what you are thinking of...
edit: yes I am a bruins fan... but you never saw us get that loony over the league botching up the bergeron hit from jones, or alberts hit from hartnell, or savard getting his back broken by the HABS' begin, or savard getting his career ruined by cooke, or pacioretty/some hab butt ending krejci in the face with his stick, or the ward sucker punch from walker, or komisarek never getting punished for cross checking (and breaking his stick over lucic's face in game 4 08-09, right after getting suspended a game for a gloved punch, which wasn't even a cross check etc etc...
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Post by Ice Dragons on Mar 12, 2011 12:42:15 GMT -5
I was laughing hard last night when Frans Nielsen who is 160 lbs. knocked down Zdeno Chara who is 9 inches taller and 90 lbs. heavier with a supposed cross check. What a laugh, talk about a diving penalty if I ever have seen one. Maybe Chara is trying to get people to feel bad for him, or maybe the NHL told the refs to protect Zdeno. At least the Islanders won! Yeah for the good guys.
All Boston teams suck! Their fans are nothing but M@ssholes ;D
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Post by BarracudasGM on Mar 13, 2011 0:40:01 GMT -5
I think the hit is just the tip of the iceberg in terms of headshots. More and more top end players are out because of concussions. Paul Kariya is not playing this season because he still has symptoms. Eric Lindros's career was cut short because of concussions. The league turns a blind eye to it realizing that there will always be an influx of young players willing to come into the league and bust their chops to play.
What people do not realize is that there was a history between Pacioretty and Chara brewing before the game. Jack Edwards of NESN was calling Max a cocky kid for pushing Chara out of the way in the OT winner he scored previously. I don't think Chara wanted to push and break his neck, but I do think that he intended to put Pacioretty into the Bruins bench with a hard check.
I think the reaction would not have been so livid if they gave him a few games. All Habs fans like me would be doing is complain that it's not enough but we'd be satisfied that the league recognizes it was a reckless play. By not giving him anything, it condones his tactics and makes it look like the league is fine with it. Heck, even one time Bruin Joe Thornton was saying that the Bruins get preferential treatment.
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Post by thunderbirds on Mar 13, 2011 11:25:13 GMT -5
I'm a little late to the discussion, but after seeing the hit many, many times I have a few things to say about it.
1) This had to be one of the most devastating hits that I've ever witnessed. I can't believe how much more Pacioretty went into that stanchion with. It was hard to watch
2) I don't think Chara intended for Pacioretty to get injured. He was just finishing his check, albeit a little late.
3) what in the world in the Prime minister of Canada weighing in on this for. Doesn't he have a country to run. Crazy!
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Post by Vampyre on Mar 13, 2011 12:17:31 GMT -5
The country pretty much runs itself despite him, actually. But that's another discussion.
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